I know the look of the flow from your IMS and VST baskets is different, but what about the taste and extraction yield (if you have a refractometer)? Maybe the appearance doesn't matter.
i definitely notice a difference in taste when it leaks like that...it results in more channelling and not as sweet of a shot as when it extracts without the leak.
i'm beginning to think its a dosage issue. when i dosed 16.5 in the VST, i got a similar streak (but not as prominent)...went up to 17.5 and no streak. I will try to dose up with the IMS and see what happens. Need a lil coffee break right now!
Good point. Check your dose, make sure you have that gap between the screen and the top of the puck. Not too big of a gap too I guess.
For reference, (on a different machine) I fit 18.4gm in a VST '15gm' basket comfortably, but the '12-18gm' IMS basket takes another 1 to 1.5gm easily with the same-ish head space.
We're lucky with this support forum. It's an IMS filter basket issue and a Monolith grinder is used, but I don't expect an equivalent forum exists by IMS Baskets to discuss grinders & espresso machines, or a forum made available by Monolith Grinders to discuss espresso machines and filter baskets ;-)
have you tried cleaning your shower screen? or alternatively look at the screen when you pull the lever down - if water is jetting out the edges of the screen at 45 degrees it needs a clean. is the screen mounted flat onto the bottom of the group? - it is fairly easy to put the screen on slightly out of level & this will definitely cause issues
that basket will definitely hold more than the 18g VST so you will need to compensate for that (more coffee, finer coffee, or a combination of the two)
you may want to try nutating with your tamper - this is good for driving the coffee into the 'corner' of the basket (where the horizontal bottom of the basket meets the vertical side of the basket)
another idea, mark where the 'leaks' are occurring with a permanent marker and try rotating the basket 90, or 180, degrees - do the 'leaks' still occur from the same holes you marked (this may indicate a manufacturing defect - I'm not saying it is a certainty, just a possibility - for example you may then want to hold the basket up to a strong light and check that all the holes are of a uniform size and shape), but if it leaks in a new location or not at all then it probably isn't the basket
thanks so much for everybody's quick and thoughtful feedback! it is very much appreciated! As Frans noted, this is the best place for feedback on our products!
@Reiss, so I have the IMS 35ūM screen and I was just reading your blog post about it this past weekend. I figured I would wait until it popped out! I checked the water stream, it was spraying a little bit, not a full 45, but I figured i would clean it anyway. After cleaning, it was a much cleaner flow of water from the screen.
My first shot after cleaning was 18g in the IMS. A small water leak came out during pre-infusion, but it stayed on the edge, didn't wander to the center like before. That said, I think I may have discovered what has been causing some of the issue?
I've noticed that my pucks were messier after extraction. maybe its always been the case, but I seemed to notice it more lately.
I then loaded up the IMS basket with 18g of coffee , inserted it into the group and pulled it back out without extracting. here is what I saw:
I tried 17g and not much a difference. I then tried 16.5 grams in the VST 18g basket, and similar result:
even tried 14g in the stock basket, here is the result:
could this be causing the issue? whats funny is the higher I dose in the basket, the problem seems to go away.
how much of the group seal (that holds the shower screen in place) is hanging below the bottom of the seal groove: there shouldnt be more than 1mm
i dont think you've got the screen hard up against the bottom of the group: remove, push the screen up hard against the bottom of the group & re-fit the group seal - drive this on with some serious grunt on the PF handle with the basket removed - you should get the handle around to the '4pm' position. ask if this description makes no sense & i will cut a video for you.
I think i know what you mean, but not completely sure.
in order to install the screen, i removed the basket from the portafilter, put the screen on the portafilter, then inserted the portafilter with the screen into the group. I then moved the PF handle as close as I could to the 3pm position to lock it in place.
images 2 & 3 appear as though the group seal is flush with the bottom of the surrounding group, but in the first image it appears as though the seal is hanging down significantly
are you able to clarify?
if it is the case that the group seal is flush with the bottom of the group then i can only conclude that you are tamping too lightly
tonight is likely to be a mega one getting LONDINIUM R out the door, but if i have some down time i will get that basket out and dose it with various doses, tamp it, and then measure how far the surface of the tamped puck is below the rim of the basket so you have a point of reference
Hi everyone, sorry to interrupt but I have a similar issue with my IMS The Single 23.5 basket. In a post about the Ristretto Reiss had recommended a dose of 10g with a 12g yield. I simply can't fit 10g of coffee into that basket without it touching the shower screen (IMS 35ūM). Not sure if this has to do with the different screen (higher dimensions than L1 original?), but can anyone here verify the max amount they actually fit into the basket? Before the 23.5 I had accidentally bought the 21.5 version which was impossible to be used on the L1, there just wasn't enough head room between the screen and the bottom corners of the basket. Best, Matt
Edit: I checked heights of both screens, original and IMS, they are the same. The lip of the IMS screen seems to curve out slightly earlier than the oringinal which probably leads to the gasket sitting slightly lower (less than 1mm that is). After a few more trials I believe the maximum amount that fits into the 23.5 IMS Single without touching the screen is 9 grams.
I think I may have found the issue, but no clue of my theory is sounds...i'm beginning to think that the problem is with the dose. Is it possible that a basket needs a minimum dose? the higher I dose, the streak goes away. For example, at 18g in the basket, i see th streak. 18.2 smaller one, 18.5, its gone. I'm seeing similar behavior with the VST basket too. It seems some coffees require a higher dose in the basket, others not so much?
Dan Tochterman post=12706 wrote: It seems some coffees require a higher dose in the basket, others not so much?
It may depend on grinder type & setting, roast and freshness. Once you get into a routine and have consistent great results, you may find it surprising that a friend who is visiting can't seem to get the same extraction with the same settings... it's all subtle.
Comments
i just tried grinding finer and even nutated a little with the tamp....no difference in result
Matt
i'm beginning to think its a dosage issue. when i dosed 16.5 in the VST, i got a similar streak (but not as prominent)...went up to 17.5 and no streak. I will try to dose up with the IMS and see what happens. Need a lil coffee break right now!
For reference, (on a different machine) I fit 18.4gm in a VST '15gm' basket comfortably, but the '12-18gm' IMS basket takes another 1 to 1.5gm easily with the same-ish head space.
have you tried cleaning your shower screen? or alternatively look at the screen when you pull the lever down - if water is jetting out the edges of the screen at 45 degrees it needs a clean. is the screen mounted flat onto the bottom of the group? - it is fairly easy to put the screen on slightly out of level & this will definitely cause issues
that basket will definitely hold more than the 18g VST so you will need to compensate for that (more coffee, finer coffee, or a combination of the two)
you may want to try nutating with your tamper - this is good for driving the coffee into the 'corner' of the basket (where the horizontal bottom of the basket meets the vertical side of the basket)
another idea, mark where the 'leaks' are occurring with a permanent marker and try rotating the basket 90, or 180, degrees - do the 'leaks' still occur from the same holes you marked (this may indicate a manufacturing defect - I'm not saying it is a certainty, just a possibility - for example you may then want to hold the basket up to a strong light and check that all the holes are of a uniform size and shape), but if it leaks in a new location or not at all then it probably isn't the basket
thanks so much for everybody's quick and thoughtful feedback! it is very much appreciated! As Frans noted, this is the best place for feedback on our products!
@Reiss, so I have the IMS 35ūM screen and I was just reading your blog post about it this past weekend. I figured I would wait until it popped out! I checked the water stream, it was spraying a little bit, not a full 45, but I figured i would clean it anyway. After cleaning, it was a much cleaner flow of water from the screen.
My first shot after cleaning was 18g in the IMS. A small water leak came out during pre-infusion, but it stayed on the edge, didn't wander to the center like before. That said, I think I may have discovered what has been causing some of the issue?
I've noticed that my pucks were messier after extraction. maybe its always been the case, but I seemed to notice it more lately.
I then loaded up the IMS basket with 18g of coffee , inserted it into the group and pulled it back out without extracting. here is what I saw:
I tried 17g and not much a difference. I then tried 16.5 grams in the VST 18g basket, and similar result:
even tried 14g in the stock basket, here is the result:
could this be causing the issue? whats funny is the higher I dose in the basket, the problem seems to go away.
here is what the basket looks like before I tamp:
and after tamping:
Attached files
i dont think you've got the screen hard up against the bottom of the group: remove, push the screen up hard against the bottom of the group & re-fit the group seal - drive this on with some serious grunt on the PF handle with the basket removed - you should get the handle around to the '4pm' position. ask if this description makes no sense & i will cut a video for you.
in order to install the screen, i removed the basket from the portafilter, put the screen on the portafilter, then inserted the portafilter with the screen into the group. I then moved the PF handle as close as I could to the 3pm position to lock it in place.
here are some photos...i hope these help?
so you have posted 3 images
images 2 & 3 appear as though the group seal is flush with the bottom of the surrounding group, but in the first image it appears as though the seal is hanging down significantly
are you able to clarify?
if it is the case that the group seal is flush with the bottom of the group then i can only conclude that you are tamping too lightly
tonight is likely to be a mega one getting LONDINIUM R out the door, but if i have some down time i will get that basket out and dose it with various doses, tamp it, and then measure how far the surface of the tamped puck is below the rim of the basket so you have a point of reference
kind regards
reiss.
sorry to interrupt but I have a similar issue with my IMS The Single 23.5 basket. In a post about the Ristretto Reiss had recommended a dose of 10g with a 12g yield. I simply can't fit 10g of coffee into that basket without it touching the shower screen (IMS 35ūM). Not sure if this has to do with the different screen (higher dimensions than L1 original?), but can anyone here verify the max amount they actually fit into the basket?
Before the 23.5 I had accidentally bought the 21.5 version which was impossible to be used on the L1, there just wasn't enough head room between the screen and the bottom corners of the basket.
Best,
Matt
Edit: I checked heights of both screens, original and IMS, they are the same. The lip of the IMS screen seems to curve out slightly earlier than the oringinal which probably leads to the gasket sitting slightly lower (less than 1mm that is).
After a few more trials I believe the maximum amount that fits into the 23.5 IMS Single without touching the screen is 9 grams.
no worries, I'll try tamping a little more in the meantime.
I think I may have found the issue, but no clue of my theory is sounds...i'm beginning to think that the problem is with the dose. Is it possible that a basket needs a minimum dose? the higher I dose, the streak goes away. For example, at 18g in the basket, i see th streak. 18.2 smaller one, 18.5, its gone. I'm seeing similar behavior with the VST basket too. It seems some coffees require a higher dose in the basket, others not so much?
It may depend on grinder type & setting, roast and freshness. Once you get into a routine and have consistent great results, you may find it surprising that a friend who is visiting can't seem to get the same extraction with the same settings... it's all subtle.