To login to the new support channel and community forums, go to the Support Portal
i have refunded your order for the Gicar as i understand you are up running again
well the cooked one has a 240V Gicar label on
the top one has a 115V Gicar label on it
if your machine is plumbed in the circuit that would connect to the low water electrodes in the bottom of the tank is likely to have a bypass wire on it as the water tank is not present in the plumbed in version, obviously
as i wrote to you by email, i found the original invoice from when we built the machine for the original owner on 17 Nov 2012:
LONDINIUM I - Luxe - plumbed / 110V, 1400W / None
the none means it was supplied without a plug
you can also see it was built as a plumbed version, so this machine was not built with a water tank, and possibly not with the associated low water control mechanism either, as it is irrelevant on a plumbed in machine
presumably someone has had a go at converting it to a tank fed machine at some time since?
I assume that if I replace the Gicar it came with - which no one over here can find - it might resume working.
The one I bought is the only one two shops offered me. I depend on the knowledge of experts or almost experts - I have no ability to engineer these things.
The reservoir contacts are not shorted because the reservoir needs to be properly sited for the machine to work and not to alarm.
Is the burned Gicar one that was installed in your factory? If so, can you sell me one?
If David switched controllers I have no way of knowing who did that work for him.
What can I do?
as i have shown from the record above, the machine in question was built as a 110V plumbed in Luxe
accordingly for absolute certain it did not leave the factory with a 240V Gicar in it, which is what the burnt out Gicar image above is
some images of how the machine looks today is probably a good place to start, and we can try and piece it together from there
you appear to now have the correct Gicar in the machine, and it is a 115V edition which is a good start
does your water tank have the low water wires connected to the bottom of the water tank? without this i expect it will go straight to alarm mode
The above shows the two terminals underneath the reservoir housing.
The green/yellow and white wires are attached to the reservoir terminals.
There is no jump across the reservoir terminals.
The harness delivers the two wires to the controller, where I attached them to the same position terminals that they were attached to on the old Gicar.
Before the controller blew, it registered whether or not the reservoir was full or properly seated.
Therefore, the fault is not with the reservoir or its attachments.
An ohmmeter reveals the reservoir to be an open circuit, therefore the controller should produce an active circuit (ie one expects to find a voltage potential created across the terminals) measuring the reservoir, not a passive one.
But when the machine is powered on, a slight 8 VAC is measured across the controller lugs (for the green/yellow and white wires), and no DC.
I am without any engineering experience, but this suggests to me that the 125v Gicar that I have is not designed for a reservoir. Maybe it is a plumbed-in model?
what is the problem you are experiencing?
when you turn the machine on does it go straight to the audible, albeit quiet to some ears, alarm?
i dont see why you think a low AC current across the terminals is a problem - it is a simple electrical switch with that we use as a low water alarm
there is no transformer or power supply in the L1(2012-16), therefore there is no DC current anywhere in the machine
More precisely, when I turn the machine on, I hear a relay click in the controller.
After 4 seconds it clicks open and the alarm come on. That's it.
What is the fix?
Here is some detail from the burned out controller. I am offering this information because the machine worked well for years with the old controller:
There was indeed a transformer in the Londinium, or more exactly, in the controller. Below is a picture of the transformer from the burned out controller. Not only is it a 12 volt transformer, but it is rated at 110 volts, even though the outer label on the burned out controller said 240 volts.
This discrepancy is very strange and just introduces more puzzle into this problem.
this machine was built as a 110V plumbed in L1(2012-16) luxe in 2012
you inform me that you purchased the machine from a deceased estate
you have found a burnt out 240V Gicar in it
that means it is that Gicar is not the original Gicar that was fitted at the factory
additionally, we have no record that we supplied the parts to convert the machine to a tank and pump fed machine to the original owner, or indeed a replacement Gicar
any non conformity has been introduced after it left the factory by a third party
we need to agree on these facts otherwise im going to walk away from this because there is simply no point in continuing
you havent spent a dime with us which means that technically you are not a customer, but you expect me to sort it out for you now that its ended in tears
now lets get started
the low water alarm is a simple electrical switch that passes a low voltage current through those two wires that connect to the brass probes in the underside of the water box carrier; if the circuit is broken the alarm sounds and the pump and heating element are turned off to protect them from running dry
in the water box carrier sits the plastic water box with two stainless pins in the bottom that sit on top of the sprung loaded brass pins in the bottom of the water box carrier
i suggest you start with a short length of light gauge electrical wire and hold one end on each of the brass terminals in the bottom of the water box; this should close the low water alarm circuit, turning the alarm off, and i would expect the pump would turn on to try and fill the boiler
removing the wire will cause the alarm to sound again and turn off the pump and the heating element, but it would establish that if the circuit is closed that the low water alarm will turn off
if you pass that test then put in the water box and before putting any water in it take your electrical wire again and place it across the top of the two stainless steel probes in the bottom of the water box; again they should close the circuit and turn the water alarm off
if you can pass these two tests you are then ready to put some water in the water box
if you put water in the water box and the low water alarm sounds the issue is the water is too soft, i.e. the electrical resistance is too high for the low voltage current to pass from one stainless probe to the other
i am assuming you have not got the 1/2" internal diameter of 40mm silicone tubing pushed onto one of the low water probes in the bottom of the tank as this is only needed on the LR, not the L1(2012-16)
if you pass the first test but not the second it is a poor contact between the top of the brass pins and the bottom of the stainless pins and i would suggest polishing the top of the brass pins with fine sandpaper as it is only a low voltage circuit
if you cant pass the first test then you will need to pull the wires off the spade connectors on the underside of the brass terminals under the water box carrier and connect those together to check that results in turning off the low water alarm
all tasks undertaken at your risk, including the risk of electrocution, as i simply have no visibility of what changes have been made to the machine since 2012. if you are uncomfortable with this get one of the people that has been working on the machine to email me and i can work with them directly
let me know how you get on
i see you have placed an order for a 115V Gicar with us
i am slightly concerned as the 115V Gicar you provide in the image at the start of this thread is, according to its markings, identical to the 115V Gicar that you have ordered from our web shop here; https://londiniumespresso.com/store/parts?product_id=219
so the only reason the one you purchase from us is going to make any difference is if the 115V Gicar you have sourced from a third party is defective, which in my experience with the Gicar is possible but highly unlikely
i direct you again to my request that you remove the water box carrier and remove the connectors from the male spade connectors on the underside of both brass terminals and join the two connectors together at that point to close the low water alarm circuit
if that does not silence the low water alarm and you have the correct Gicar then surely the issue must lie in the wiring itself
it would be fairly easily to mix up a colour when wiring in the new Gicar
my suggestion is you hold off buying the 115V Gicar from us as based on the limited information i have i dont think it is going to change anything
let me know and i can refund you in full immediately
me selling you a Gicar does not mean i can wave a magic wand over any other changes that have been made to the machine in the last 8 years
im happy to help you work through it, but i dont think throwing money at the problem is a good place to start
i have refunded your order for the Gicar as i understand you are up running again